#F1 Qualifying Review: Rosberg leads the Silver Arrows 1-2

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Brought to you by TheJudge13 contributor Mattpt55

2014 Brazilian GP Qualifying

 

Cloudy, 36°C Track Temp, 25°C Ambient and brutal threat of rain marked the start of qualifying for the Brazilian Grand Prix. Despite the promise of the weather, it never delivered more than a few drops, leaving a mostly dry qualifying on the slick, black tarmac of the newly resurfaced Interlagos. Giving exactly the results that might be expected this late in the season, with Mercedes yet again dominant and Williams nipping at their heels, a few jeweled surprises were nonetheless to be found. Chief among them Gutierrez redeemed himself after last week’s execrable race by almost making Q3 and Rosberg and Hamilton finally put on a display worthy of their relative talents, with Nico taking pole yet again, this time by only 0.03 seconds, promising fireworks for tomorrow’s race

Q1

AS with all sessions, the opening of the pit lane coincided with almost a minute of inactivity, before the Saubers sprang into action. Sutil lead the way, no doubt wishing to get as much running in as possible before the end of the season, followed by Gutierrez. Deciding the track looked inviting, Ricciardo and Kvyat followed suit at the 16 minute mark, as the Saubers were both firmly into their routine, with all four on Softs.

Vergne scrambled out moments after his teammate as Sutil cracked timing and scoring for the first lap driven in anger, with the cars clearly still looking for grip and plainly squirreling about on the freshly laid surface. Sutil got some nice face time as he notched the first target, a 1:13.401, which was immediately bested by Gutierrez, nearly 0.3 seconds faster.

Meanwhile, Hamilton and a gaggle of Williams joined the fun, the Williams being the first to employ the Mediums in pursuit of Q2. Whilst the World Feed skipped directly to Kvyat swinging his rears wide through Juncao and almost losing it on the exit over the kerbs, Ricciardo finished up a neat 1:12.825 and taking top honours for the moment.

With the clock approaching the 13 minute mark, Rosberg and the Force India’s joined the ever busier circuit, leaving just the McLaren’s and Ferrari’s to play the waiting game as Kvyat crossed the line ahead of his soon to be teammate, Ricciardo in a 1:12.555, having justified his theatrics back at Turn 12. Vergne was next to toss up a number, and he was having none of it from the youngster as he crushed him by nearly 0.002 of a second, whilst the Mercedes of Rosberg and Hamilton circled the track on their warm ups like a pair of hungry, pelagic sharks.

Hulkenberg ran a solid 1:12.491 as Hamilton got his lap underway, leaving only a solitary Sebastian Vettel in the pitlane as the clock turned over the 12 minute mark. Bottas on the Mediums scored a 1:11.834 and Massa quickly trumped him with 1:11.57. Rosberg appeared to have the S1 advantage as he, too, started his first hot lap. Maldonado decided to go off road as Lewis posted up to the top spot, but not for long as Nico came through nearly half a second faster, well into the 1:10’s.

McLaren, like Williams, were running the Medium and it was K-Mag scraping into 5th place as Bottas failed to topple Massa from P3 with the 10 minute mark approaching. Alonso was very unhappy about some setting on his car over the radio as he attempted to set his first timed lap.

Hamilton’s 4th lap saw him turn the track purple to take top spot back from Rosberg as Alonso infiltrated the top 3. Gutierrez was hanging tough in P8 as it was Button who had yet to get a good effort in, still languishing in the 1:12’s as time ticked away, down to the 8 minute mark. Rosberg missed out on S1, but got on top of the rest of his lap to reclaim P1 by a tenth as Vettel continued to sit in the garage.

Despite being P14, Maldonado had a bit of fun with Alonso, slipstreaming and passing the Spaniard across the start finish line, no doubt improving the Ferrari man’s mood tremendously.

By the 7 minute mark all the runners began to cycle through the pits, looking to take on fresh tyres and have a quick look at their telemetry before venturing back out. Button made the switch to the Softs and Vettel, clearly on a strategic play of some kind, finally headed out to set his mark. Vettel, Button, Vergne and Grosjean were in the bottom 4 as the majority of the field prepared for its second run .

Down to 5 minutes, Button was the first to make the leap, into P3 on the softs, barely edging his teammate who had made the same switch. Now it was Maldonado, Grosjean, Vergne and Vettel at the bottom, with Sutil poised on the edge and Vettel on a flyer. With the exception of a stunning Gutierrez in P5, all the top 10 were still lodged in the pits with under 3 minutes to go. Kvyat joined the top 10 by knocking Esteban back one spot to P6, as Raikkonen dropped to P10 in the pits and the track continued to evolve. Vettel exited the bottom feeders group with a less than exciting P12 as Vergne, Maldonado, Perez and Grosjean were left to try and extricate themselves, Sutil having taken P14 in the meantime.

Perez’ improvement sent Ricciardo into peril in P15 as the Aussie was on a fast lap which turned out to be more than good enough to send Maldonado into one of the places of doom. Bottas took the decision to set another time as Hulkenberg popped up in P11. Ricciardo completed another lap, this time for P9 which immediately sent the Force India back a step, though still ahead of the Colgate Kid’s teammate, who was hanging about in P13.

Having slid down to P8 whilst in the garage, Massa decided to give it one more go and headed for the pit exit with 2 minutes approaching on the clock and Maldonado once again ran off the track in his pursuit of lap time.

Down to a minute left and it was still Vergne, Perez, Maldonado and Grosjean with the Do Not Pass Go card, and Sutil barely safe, just a tenth away from disaster with all on fast laps. Given the rapid evolution of the track, only the top 4 stayed put, though Hulkenberg was the first of the midfield to park it up, 0.2 clear of P15 but having had a bouncy reentry to the track after a bit of rallycross practice.

After completing his effort, Perez saw no improvement still in P16 as NBC reported light rain in the pits in the waning moments of Q1. As the checkers dropped he would have one more go round to get clear, though with a 7 spot penalty staring him in the face it would make little real difference to his starting position on the grid. Ahead, the rest were in the throes of their last efforts to stay clear of the exclusion club.

Up at the front, Bottas reclaimed 3rd on the softs, also breaking into the 1:10’s while RoGro was only able to improve to P15, not enough to make Q2. Sutil was next across, unable to make a better time, but Kimi was, up into P7. Maldonado was unable to even better his P18, such was the dismal nature of his Lotus, leaving only Perez with a chance to make it it into Q2 and smite Sutil. But it was not to be, with Grosjean, Vergne, Perez and Maldonado left on the sidelines as the session continued.

Q2

In between sessions, Vergne apologised to the team, but called his car “undriveable” after his significant loss of practice time. Hulkenberg, the sole remaining Force India driver, became first to exit the pits with less than a minute gone off the clock, again venturing out on the softs. Gutierrez followed suit and then his teammate Sutil. Halfway through Hulkenberg’s lap, Alonso joined the fray and then Hamilton jumped in as well. Raikkonen hit the circuit just as the Force India driver threw up a time in the 1:12’s, clearly not his most serious effort.

Those drivers had the sandbox to themselves through the 12 minute mark, as the remainder of the field chose to sit in their garage and watch the fireworks for the moment. AS Rosberg decided to jump up, Sutil decided to simply ignore T12 and have an extended off track adventure that ended with him back in the pitlane rather than finishing his lap.

The rest continued anon and it was only Hulkenberg leading Gutierrez, both with times in the 1:12’s as the finish line beckoned. Massa was now out on scrubbed Softs, whilst the Mercedes availed themselves of the new set they had saved from the previous session. Nice, screaming lock up by Alonso into the twisty bits clearly audible as he tried to put down more brake pedal than the tyres could handle. He backed out and Hamilton came round to take P1 in a 1:10.712, well clear of anyone but Rosberg, who, perhaps enjoying not leading the championship, easily took P1 off Lewis and nearly 0.4 seconds off his time, very similar to the pattern of Q1. The Ferraris of Raikkonen and Alonso slot just behind as Williams and McLaren get their program underway, along with Vettel as the clock crossed the 9 minute mark.

That failed to last long as Massa rapidly took P3 off Raikkonen whilst Rosberg complained of his rears overheating. Though not much of a problem in today’s session given his times, no doubt Mercedes engineers were suffering a bit of PTSD given their tyre issues in past seasons. Bottas thoroughly disappointed the crowd by displacing Massa nearly a minute later at the 7 minute mark, with the McLarens half a lap behind to set their first times and Hamilton headed into the pits to look for his missing half second.

First Button, then Vettel and finally Magnussen came through lining themselves up P5, P7 and P6 accordingly and showed a solid gap to the Ferraris, who look to be desperately hanging on for the end of the season and a chance to retrench.

With 6 minutes come and gone on the clock, it looked to be Ricciardo waiting for a single run to set his time, along with Sutil and Kvyat. The Mclarens and Vettel returned to the pits and as everyone waited, once again the Force India of Hulkenberg was first out around the 4:30 mark to kick off the second wave of runs. Down to 3 minutes he continued his run, with a big lockup of the left front into T1 to mark his first effort to better his time and only Alonso for company.

Raikkonen emerged the other side of 3 minutes and rolling down the hill towards the 2 minute mark the rest of the bottom 10 began to emerge for their final efforts at gaining Q3.

Hulkenberg was first to improve his time, going significantly faster on his fresh set of Softs, but failing to make headway in the position department, still in P10. Alonso, however did better his position and time, making it P7 and leapfrogging Vettel who was also out on track.

Less than a minute left and still Kvyat sat in his garage, looking less and less likely to try and set a time whilst Kimi took P6, two places ahead of Alonso. Ricciardo slewed it around the final turn for his only chance to advance with his teammate going round, trying to maintain P9 in the last onslaught of times.

Kvyat bailed with 20 seconds left, perhaps choosing to start from the pitlane given his penalty whilst Ricciardo twitched into the final corners, looking very P5ish. AS the checkers once again flew, it was Gutierrez besting Hulkenberg for P10 in a magnificent drive for him, but immediately being relegated as Ricciardo delivered, but only P7. But that was not to last as Vettel came good P6, dropping Alonso to P10 to round out the session. Gutierrez, Hulkenberg, Sutil and Kvyat out and the rest going forward.

Q3

IN stark contrast to the previous 2 sessions, it was Hamilton first out after just over a minute had elapsed in the session. Rosberg was next, nearly half a minute later. After a brief pause, the Williams of Bottas joined in, followed by Ricciardo. The Mclarens and Bottas weren’t far behind and as he streaked to his first timed lap, Hamilton was clearly keen as purple sectors popped up before he crossed start/finish to officially begin his lap.

Massa and Vettel rolled onto the circuit as Lewis completed his first lap, clocked at a staggering 1:10.195 , though behind him Rosberg was already setting purple sectors and once again bested Hamilton, coming across the line with 7:30 left, but this time only 0.03 up. With both Mercedes done with their first efforts, the rest of the field began to sort themselves out.

The dust began to settle with 6 minutes left and the Ferrari’s clearly committed to having an espresso and gelato before hitting the track. Bottas with some big lock-ups, Button, Magnussen and Ricciardo all flashed across withing seconds of each other. Moments later, Massa came by to take P3 away by 0.081 seconds, slotting Vettel and Ricciardo into P8 and P9 with the second set of runs to come.

With 4 minutes to go, everyone was in the pits when Ferrari decided to make their move with Raikkonen, stronger in the first two sessions, out first. Ricciardo was next to dip his toes in the water, followed quickly by Vettel. Alonso, Hamilton Bottas and Button were the next group out. Rosberg, Massa and Magnussen were the final runners, leaving themselves less than 2 minutes to reach the line for their final shot at glory.

Hamilton started the drama, reporting a right rear brake reading of 0, but was reassured by the team that they saw it and all was well, just a sensor issue. Ricciardo crossed the line into tyre smoke from Massa hitting T1, maintaining P7 but having one more bite at the apple. Vettel was next taking P6 provisionally.

Hamilton was first of the sharp end to hit, miraculously improving his time to 1:10.056 despite a big lockup, but Rosberg was going to give him no quarter, already up on his lap and coming through in a 1:10.023 to take pole and drive a stake through the heart of those who complain about the speed and power of the new engines. Massa bailed on his last effort and brought it in, setting the top 5 as Rosberg, Hamilton, Massa, Bottas and Button. Following, it was Vettel, Magnussen, Alonso, Ricciardo and Raikkonen to round out the top 10, with Alonso again pulling a performance out of his car where there seemed to be none.

Brazil, Championship and Rain are all words that when put together have yielded great excitement. With the forecast for rain tomorrow and the championship not yet decided, with luck we will get a barn burner of a race for the second straight week.

# Driver Ctry Team
1 Nico Rosberg Mercedes
2 Lewis Hamilton Mercedes
3 Felipe Massa Williams
4 Valtteri Bottas Williams
5 Jenson Button McLaren
6 Sebastian Vettel Red Bull
7 Kevin Magnussen McLaren
8 Fernando Alonso Ferrari
9 Daniel Ricciardo Red Bull
10 Kimi Raikkonen Ferrari
11 Esteban Gutierrez Sauber
12 Nico Hulkenberg Force India
13 Adrian Sutil Sauber
14 Romain Grosjean Lotus
15 Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso
16 Pastor Maldonado Lotus
17 Daniil Kvyat Toro Rosso
Daniil Kvyat – 7 place grid penalty for Kvyat – carry over of engine penalty
18 Sergio Perez Force India
Sergio Perez – 7 Place grid penalty-Causing collision in USGP

49 responses to “#F1 Qualifying Review: Rosberg leads the Silver Arrows 1-2”

  2. This was a close qualifying. Rosberg gets the Pole Trophy, congrats to him. Hamilton and/or Rosberg could perhaps have broken through the 1’10” barrier today.

    I just hope both Rosberg and Hamilton can get through Turn 1-2-3 without any damage. Then it should be a good race. Rosberg’s recent record doesn’t speak in his favour but it only takes a second to break momentum. Let’s see if Hamilton can repeat the trick he did in Japan and Austin tomorrow.

  3. “with Nico taking pole yet again, this time by only 0.03 seconds”

    How many centimeters is that? 🙂

    • Track is 4309m long, and they went round in about 70 sec, so 0.03 sec equates to around 1.85m – unless they’re going a lot slower than the average 220kmh speed as they cross the line, which isn’t the case.

      I think Toto’s math is off.

      • Hmm, the Toto’s math seems to make sense to me… you’re right about the computation:
        (4309 ∕ 70.023) ⋅ 0.033
        ≈ 2.0307185

        So we’re talking about approximately 2m at average speed (220kph). At the checkers however cars are much closer to the 315kph top speed, which would mean that the distance would be smaller than 2m. So Toto’s 1.3m feels right around the ballpark…

          • Having gone back to the drawing board, yeah, I guess you’re right!

            For a fixed amount of time (0.03s), a higher speed implies greater distance traveled. So at the checkers the difference between Britney and Bozo must have been bigger than 2m. Nice catch!

            Actually I think we can even estimate that. 220(km ∕ h) ≈ 61.111111(m ∕ s), which means that… hmm… painful math memories resurface from 3rd grade math exercises… 🙂

            So let’s see. For an average speed of 220(km ∕ h), the distance traveled in 0.033s is:
            61.111111 ⋅ 0.033
            ≈ 2.0166667

            So about 2.02m. For a (conservative estimate of the) start/finish speed at ~300(km ∕ h), the distance traveled would be:
            83.333333 ⋅ 0.033
            ≈ 2.75

            So, yeah, Toto’s math seems off. Britney and Bozo would have been separated by around 2.75m…

  4. LH’s massive lockup cost him the pole but Nico deserves credit for his quali efforts throughout the season and is worthy of his new trophy.

    The final two races are set up up brilliantly. We could see some major fireworks….

  5. “Hamilton was first of the sharp end to hit, miraculously improving his time to 1:10.056 despite a big lockup, but Rosberg was going to give him no quarter, already up on his lap and coming through in a 1:10.023 to take pole”

    Good performance by Rosberg, even though it’s not the first time that the Hamsberg duo end up with near-identical times while Hamilton has big lock-ups on the last flying lap. I think we witnessed this at least 3 times this season.

    ” top 5 as Rosberg, Hamilton, Massa, Bottas and Button. Following, it was Vettel, Magnussen, Alonso, Ricciardo and Raikkonen to round out the top 10, with Alonso again pulling a performance out of his car where there seemed to be none.”

    Good performance by Vettel beating Ricciardo. And by Kimi getting the heat to Fred. I think it was more noticeable how happier Kimi was with the car, given tire behavior on the new surface and his beloved sharpy front end returning from the dead. I guess he likes to stick it with the sharp end…

    Also, it was nice to see from Button to Alonso within a squeaker of 0.05 seconds, and from Button to Raikkonen a mere 0.2 seconds. I guess now we’re seeing a convergence in the midfield (RB, Ferrari, McLaren) and at the sharp end (Merc and Williams).

    • Absolutely my view. 6 cars in less than 0.2 tenths. If we had the 10 front cars in that time spread, F1 would be so much interesting.

      • I think the closest we got to this was Spa quali, probably in 2009. Over that monstrosity of long circuit (by modern standards) all cars were spread barely by 1sec or so… In Q2 all top15 runners were spread by a bare 0.592, while in Q3 the top9 were separated by only 0.480.

        That was pretty cool!!

    • “I guess now we’re seeing a convergence in the midfield (RB, Ferrari, McLaren) and at the sharp end (Merc and Williams).”

      Also note how the tectonic plates shift with Caterham and Marussia dead. The new midfield is RB, Ferrari, McLaren, while the backmarkers are FI, Lotus and Sauber. So the ingenious types at Merc, Ferrari and Red Bull are pushing to exterminate the newly promoted… ahem… demoted backmarkers.

      And what shall happen? With FI, Lotus and Sauber gone, we shall have RB, Ferrari and McLaren dicing it out for the last place. Surely after the vast experiences that we witnessed, with Honda, Toyota, BMW all retired after a couple of years their boards grew tired of this “marketing exercise” going belly up.

      And how long do you reckon it shall take Ferrari or RB to pull out if they consistently finish outside top10, weekend in weekend out? And how long will it take for Merc to fall from grace, just like RB have this year? And how long will Merc’s board endure bad PR at such ridiculous tag prices….

      • “And what shall happen? With FI, Lotus and Sauber gone, we shall have RB, Ferrari and McLaren dicing it out for the last place.”

        And if anyone had any illusions about this, Sky’s commentary today was very revealing: “And now Rosberg would be passing the backmarkers… […] Bottas”

        If they push the minnows out, F1 would be digging its own grave, it seems.

  6. Just a thought.

    Hamilton has always been known for his qualifying pace but of late Rosberg has shown he’s is equal.

    I was wondering that as the Mercedes are more than likely to be 1 2 on the grid, could Hamilton actually be setting his car up for race pace rather than qualy.

    He’s starting at the front, setup belter for tyre wear, and more than likely be able to pass Rosberg mid to end race (as long as no safety car).

    Just wondering and this could be a load Horlicks but I thought I’d ask the courtroom for their opinion.

    • I’m slightly doubtful about that theory, but he’s certainly not as desperate to get pole as he once was.
      A few years back he used regularly to burn through his tyre allocation chasing pole, while Vettel in particular would save a set, and then suffer in the race. He’s a much cannier driver these days.

      It’s not impossible, though, and with the weather clearing up, we might find out this afternoon.

      • ” he’s certainly not as desperate to get pole as he once was.”

        My thoughts exactly. It seems to me that Lewis is slowly coming of age, and realizing that at the end of the day is he is going after the WDC trophy, and not risking it all for getting 1st in each and every session…

        • What’s telling was the onboard footage of both drivers, Nico seems to be a lot more aggressive with the steering wheel, something that Lewis was known for, but on the footage yesterday that wasn’t the case. No wasted movement, and on the lockup in T10, it looked like he turned in real early, which may have caused the lockup under braking.

          He just needs to finish on the podium today, hopefully the weather is consistent and not like the typical Brazilian weather.

    • Lewis seems to be having some brake issues as of lately. Never before have i seen him have so many lock ups and unusual rear locking in practice sessions. Whether that’s him and the team working to find the limit and experimenting with the brakes I dont know, but he doesn’t seem to be able to brake as late as he use to in his McLaren days – If you watch the US GP in 2012 again, he was absolutely mighty on the brakes when catching Vettel and closed up so much in the braking zones. Hopefully Merc can improve this for him and see him back to his best in braking.

      • He’s suffering the same problems as other drivers, who rely on late or strategic braking. Back in the day you pressed the brake pedal and the hydraulics put the brake pads to the brake discs, giving appropriate feedback to the driver. The brake-by-wire system takes the pedal input and a computer splits the ‘desired braking force’ into partial engagement of the MGU-K to harvest energy and partial application of the brake pads. if the generator has harvested enough energy it is turned off and the now lost braking effect is corrected by the computer by putting more braking force on the conventional brakes. So you have a blip if braking force mid-braking as well as lack of feedback via the pedal. It has gotten better over the year, but the bbw system is nowhere near as controllable as the hydraulic system yet. Lewis, Vettel and Kimi suffer a lot from that, while drivers like Alonso, who rely more on stabilizing the car using throttle input have less problems.

        • Thanks for that info hippo. Just a question, does the BBW affect the front brakes as well? Because it seems most of his braking lookups occur on the fronts and if it’s there to harvest energy for the MGU-K, then I’d assume it won’t have any bearing on front braking.

          • It affects both front and rear breaks. If anything it makes small changes in break balance more influential. Lewis had a spin in FP3 after changing brake balance from 55% to 53%. Just two percent of change and he Flintstone’d his tyres.

          • Doesn’t bbw mean something completely different on the Internet? Hahahha. Couldn’t resist. 😉

        • Interesting, thanks. Still good to see that Hamilton is still able to put the quick laps in despite this. Hopefully the team will get this sorted and I would expect to see Lewis in his element in qualifying next year much more than this year as braking is where a lot of his time comes from. Encouraging to see he can outperform Nico despite this.

        • Having driven a rental with BBW, I can attest it’s incredibly wonky. The difference between harvesting and not was noticeable and disturbing. It’s astonishing to me that they are able to get it as close as they do in F1. Can’t wait for that to hit the commercial market.

  7. Although the cars have dramatically improved over the season, the difference in times here in particular might be misleading due to the resurfacing. With Button saying that “Interlagos doesn’t feel like Interlagos any more” due to the bumpy surface being smoothed out, it would surely follow that setups can be optimised more than in previous years due to not having to take into account the harsher bumps? As a result of that the times would naturally come down a touch anyway?

    That’s all hypothetical of course, but I would have thought it would have had an impact on times.

    • I wish someone will come in and wash away all those artificial gimmicks: crappy tyres, DRS, double points, flags on screens instead of real ones and make F1 real again. What was again the last pre-Pirelli season? I think 2010 or was it 2009? I liked those seasons. There was no need for these ‘fixes’.

  9. Has anybody else analysed the varying statements, and body language, from Merc, during the year…?
    At the beginning, when it was realised the Mercs. might be winning most of the races, and that Lewis and Nico were quite evenly matched, the official word from Toto and Niki was: When the championship is beyond reach the two guys could fight it out.
    I haven’t heard this mentioned for some months.
    After Austin, Sky asked this of Toto and he no longer acknowledged the possibility, and changed the subject.
    Since Monaco there has been a different atmosphere from Merc personnel in interviews, and Lewis and Nico couldn’t even LOOK at each other on the podiums… [ and even Brundle yesterday declared he was now tending to believe Nico’s Monaco action was deliberate… ]
    Then came Spa and things changed even more.
    Nico seemed to have been ‘ordered’ to accept / take / admit the blame, AND the punishment… and the upshot is now Nico and Lewis behave like competitive teammates on the podiums, not enemies.
    Since Spa Nico tends to lock his brakes during the race, which allows Lewis to pass, while Lewis locks up during quali, which allows Nico to take Pole.
    And, along with this, the Pole Trophy.
    My suspicion is that Merc have pre-decided who will take the Drivers’ Championship… and it seems that Nico gets the consolation prize.
    Compared with previous seasons, and even the beginning of this year, both drivers have been driving, and behaving, differently since the summer break…

    Anybody… No…!

    • The problem for Mercedes is that they have openly tried to stage manage the races, not necessarily in terms of outcome but in terms of when the action would occur during the race.

      This makes it hard to watch and not ask the exact questions you are asking, which is off putting to say the least in terms of getting excited about the race.

      That said, I look at Hamilton’s pass at Austin, or them trading tenths during the last 10 laps and on the whole it seems like some honest racing, though I can’t imagine what they would do if Hamilton pulls a Vettel and spins it in the first lap, or has a DNF etc… Most likely a pile of large golden excrement will be deposited in various non executive washrooms, LOL..

  10. That’s some interesting news. Ferrari and Redbull to run 3 cars next season, could Fred be staying at Ferrari after all?

  11. I just found out I make parts of ferrari and force india cars. On rtl there was a little special on the dampers. And they are made by zf. And coincidently we make the cilinders for them. I guess I’ll be working a little bit harder Monday 🙂

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